points projection

[rodo]

I have a free form surface, made with STYLE feature. I would like to project points array onto this surface, so the points should be projected in normals. As a result I should get let say 3000 points projected onto a free form surface. Actually I need the coordinates of those projected points. I tried many different things, but I was really dissapointed, because ProE is not cappable to do this. It can project only one point, but not array of points at the same time.


The other solution would be to make rectangular pattern on a free form surface, and in this way cover the surface with points. But it doesn't work, because the pattern could be done only on plane features, but not on free form features. I was also asking support from ProE but they couldn't do it.


But I succeddeed in doing this same thing with a few clicks in good old Mechanical Desktop 4.0.


Do you know any solution for this inside ProE ?


Niko

 

[dlongmi]

Rodo,


The solution isn't elegant but here it is.


Create a datum curve in the direction of the projection with dims that you can pattern, say x and y dims. Make sure the curve is long enough so that itintersects your surface. Before you pattern the curve add a point at the intersection of the curve and surface. Make sure you pick the surface as the first feature in the intersect.


Pattern the curve then ref pattern the point. As long as your style feature is one surface it will find each intersection. If you have multiple boundaries within the surface the intersect will fail as it crosses into the adjacent surface. Also I believe if the curves go outside the surf boundary the pattern will not work either.


D

 

[jeff4136]

I must be a lot rustier with MDT than I thought; how did you do it?

Seeing the surface or something similar and knowing the purpose; what's defining the point distribution, would help to determine the procedure (none of which will be very "straight forward", AFAIK).

Will something like ...

View attachment 989

... help any?

 

[rodo]

View attachment 990

 

[rodo]

This is a 3D free form surface which was strewed with points in Mechanical Desktop. The problem for solutions which were proposed by dlongmi and jeff is that this solution can not be done for a large amount of points, because I have projected on a surface about 4500 points.


But this is not only a problem in ProE, it can not be done in Catia also. Until now I discovered only MD and Powershape from Delcam, which are capable of performing this kind of operation. Powershape can even make "free form" pattern on any kind of surface directly, without projection.


In MD this is done like this:


You make array of points with the raster which you wish, on a rectangle, then you move this array above the free form surface, and under surface menu, you pick "Create wireframe" and "Project wire". It is very simple.


Does any body know how is possible to get The coordinates X,Y,Z from these strewed points on a surface? I mean in a text file?


Thank you for answers

 

[james.lynch]

<DIV>
<DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>export your model as an IGES file. You can then parse out the points in Excel, or you can use a script thatBrian_Adkins wrote a while back:</DIV>
<DIV> [url]http://www.mcadcentral.com/proe/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=23 838&KW=adkins+points[/url]</DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>James </DIV>

 

[rodo]

Thank you for your hint, James.


I did it with IGES and Excel.

 

[jeff4136]

Thanks, James (and Brian_Adkins). That's a nice routine to have on hand.

Also, in that thread dougr says (paraphrased)
You can create them (*.ibl) inside of Pro/E:
http://lti.dem.ist.utl.pt/faq/pro18/howto/dtr810/dtr810.htm
The link is dead. I'd like to get a handle on it if anyone has any info.

Rodo, another possibility that might help: You can create a fill pattern of datum axes within a sketched datum of surface boundary projections. Create a point at the intersection of the master axis and surface then create a reference pattern of surface intersection points. If desired you can create the surface intersection point and pattern in an empty part file within the context of an assembly.



View attachment 991

 

[james.lynch]

cheers.. but it was all brian's idea.. I asked a similar question a few months back..


and it was repeated on the PTC/User"model" exploder this week so it jogged my memory.





Glad it helped anyway!


James

 

[james.lynch]

if memory serves me, I think that wf3.0 can also pattern very easily over a surface... I'll look into it.

 

[rodo]

Jeff,


this is the right solution to the problem, the picture is very nice, and I guess the number of points could be also very huge.


But since I am not regular ProE user, can you explain the procedure a little bit more in detail, for example "how to make sketched datum of surface boundary" and when I get surface intersection point, "how to make the surface area pattern", am I limited with the number of ponts?


Thanks a lot again for very nice hint

 

[jeff4136]

I'm don't know if what I did is the most efficient way (was, in fact, a bit of experimentation), but will describe ...

Create a Sketched Datum on a suitable Datum Plane. Project (Sketch, Edge, Use or "Create an entity from an edge" button).

Create a Datum Point within the boundary of the Sketched Datum feature. I used a Sketched Datum Point dimensioned off of the Sketched Datum references, near a corner.

Create a Datum Axis using the point, normal to plane.

Pattern (Fill option) the axis. I used a small boundary offset value (.025) so no pattern instance is coincident with a boundary curve.

I then put this file (surface and axis pattern) in an assembly and created a new (Empty) part in the assembly. I just did this to make sure it would work as expected and end up with a file containing only the datum points (maybe simplify extracting the point coords later?).

Activate the new part and create a datum point at the intersection of the 'master' axis and surface. (Note that it may be necessary to set a config option to open the part with external references without having the referenced files "in session" at a later time.)

Pattern the point using the Reference option.

I suppose a large number of points are possible. About 3200 in the experiment. On my old, slow computer it takes a little while to generate the pattern, highlight it, etc.

(If needed I can try to post or email the files; ~1 MB zipped.)

 

[james.lynch]

supressing the pattern should reduce the file size considerably..


can I have the model anyway it you canot post it? [email protected]


Cheers,


James

 

[jeff4136]

2005-07-02_194928_tmp1.zip

I'll bend the rules bit and post in two installments. Attached is parent part and assy, child part to follow.

Addendum:
Attachments are WF2.
There are suppressed features in the attached part.
Edited by: jeff4136

 

[jeff4136]

2005-07-02_195605_srf_int_pts.prt.zip

Child part.

I have seen (I think) links to repositories where one can supposedly upload larger files for others to access, but have neglected to bookmark them. If someone were to post a link ...

 

[rodo]

Jeff and James, can you tell me how to get rid off all of these datum axes and signs for datum points, I mean all of these letters and numbers are very disturbing, the picture is very unclear. I can switch off datum axes, after pattern them, but I must not switch off datum points, because I need them

 

[james.lynch]

tools/environment.. will give you all the display options you need,, but you also hava a viewdatums toolbarwhich you can toggle on and off the points/planes/csys/axis.


I'd recomend going through the intro an dadvanced hands on workshops available at


http://www.ptc.com/go/wildfire/learn/how2_intro/index.htm


http://www.ptc.com/go/wildfire/learn/how2/index.htm


models available


http://www.ptc.com/events/handson/index.htm


it's good!


JAmes

 

[rodo]

Jeff, can you be so good and explain how did you manage to make cross sections pattern, together with points on curves ? (it is about the picture you posted 1. of July).


I made cross section through a single datum plane, but can not make a pattern from this cross section through the entire surface. How did you manage to put points on this datum curve ? I tried with local group, but still doesn't work.


Thank you

 

[jeff4136]

2005-07-03_133322_prt0002.prt.zip

I had pitched the previous file, so this one is a little different (again, it's the result of a little experimentation to get something "sensible" (?).

Re the attached (WF2):

1) Create a Datum Pnt (PNT0) on edge, offset 1 / spaces (e.g. some arbitrary value of your chosing).

2) Pattern - Dimension option - along edge.

3) Create a Datum Plane (DTM1): Parallel to some reference plane, thru PNT0.

4) Create Intersect crv (DTM1 & surface).

5) Create Datum Point (PNT8) on int crv, offset 1 / spaces.

6) Pattern PNT8 - Dimension option (1/spaces, .11 REL, d329), instances (spaces - 1; *don't try to go to end of crv, I think there's a rounding issue / bug?).

7) Create Datum Point (PNT16) on int crv end.

8) Group DTM1 thru PNT16 (YES to "include all between").

9) Pattern the group - Reference option (references PATTERN_1_OVER_SPACES).

(Hope I got that right.)

*I noticed this, think it may be a documented issue; if you try to specify an additional pattern along curve instance (e.g. the last instance should be on curve end) you'll notice it falls a little short. I think this might be a rounding issue. Also believe that if the pattern is driven via Relation it calcs to double float accuracy vs. some user defined accuracy. If anyone knows what's really going on and can correct me or elaborate...?

----------------------------------------------

I believe it would be pretty easy to set this all up and drive it with a couple of parameters (i.e. x_spaces, z_spaces). I didn't get into relations on this example so as not to create additional confusion in the event you are not familiar with their definition and usage.

Patterns can also be a little confusing to define. Holler back if you have problems with them.

================================================

 

[rodo]

I have succeeded, following your explanation, but it is quite a long procedure, and mistake could be done very easily. Actually deeper and deeper as I move into ProE, I realize that everything could be done, but the procedures are quite tiresome, and sometimes not in a scope of "user friendly".


Thank you Jeff