Another PTC loss...

[dougr]

Think this was bad, wait for the next one !!!



** When it rains, it pours -- Pressured by falling sales and losses, Parametric Technology also faces a $100 million lawsuit from superdealer Rand Worldwide.



Somebody mentioned something about fighting over deck chairs on the Titanic...

 

[dr_gallup]

What kills me is that we bought our seats back when it cost $20,000 and now they want me to pay to upgrade them to get the functionality they sell for $5000!

 

[biff]

Ptc make another loss, well just because they make a loss it does not make the software poor.



PTC have got to stop ripping off companies with the maintenance deals.



Does anyone know anything about UG being up for sale?



If so who's favourite to buy it?

 

[Israr]

In Pakistan UG dealers have given free licenses to almost 70 percent of Universities and they are spreading the rumours that PTC is facing lots of financial problems and its future is bleak. They say it will be UG to dominate CAD world. Others say it will be CATIA. We are worried if the rumours turn true in the coming 5-10 years.

Please comment.



Israr

 

[swcalvert]

UG was under the EDS umbrella several years ago and then they went public as 'Unigraphics Solutions', since then and since they have been making money EDS had decided to buy them back. I guess there was some kind of agreement in the initial public offering clause. I'm not sure why they (EDS) bought them back, UG isn't making the ROI as it used to, mainly because of Solid Works.



Back to the license thing for a moment, if I could. We bought one of our competors a couple of years ago and in the deal we have many outdated (not under any maintenance contract) licenses of PTC products, one of which is the mechanica stuff. It's not making any money for PTC and we need it but we don't want to pay the large back maintenance fees that PTC requires to bring it up to the current revision of Wildfire. This is what I don't like.



Steve C

 

[biff]

You have hit the nail on the head.

If PTC got a grip on the maintenance issue then they would do much better.



I had a disagreement with a PTC salesman on the telephone. He would not accept my argument that the maintenance deals were a total rip off for what you get.



Language barriers with technical support staff.

Online support which does not cover aspects you require plus solutions sitting under different modules.

This site offers more help than PTCs on line help.



So basically we in the UK get hammered to the grand total of

 

[biff]

You have hit the nail on the head.

If PTC got a grip on the maintenance issue then they would do much better.



I had a disagreement with a PTC salesman on the telephone. He would not accept my argument that the maintenance deals were a total rip off for what you get.



Language barriers with technical support staff.

Online support which does not cover aspects you require plus solutions sitting under different modules.

This site offers more help than PTCs on line help.



So basically we in the UK get hammered to the grand total of

 

[biff]

You have hit the nail on the head.

If PTC got a grip on the maintenance issue then they would do much better.



I had a disagreement with a PTC salesman on the telephone. He would not accept my argument that the maintenance deals were a total rip off for what you get.



Language barriers with technical support staff.

Online support which does not cover aspects you require plus solutions sitting under different modules.

This site offers more help than PTCs on line help.



So basically we in the UK get hammered to the grand total of

 

[Brian_Adkins]

Maintenance fees are just part of buying high-end software. They typically range from 15-25% and PTC falls into this category (that is percentage of the purchase price per year).



I think PTC used to be 25% for foundation and 13% beyond that, but it's been a while since I actually dealt with a salesman.



good article:

http://www.nwfusion.com/careers/2002/0218man.html

PDF version: http://www.proecentral.com/portal/forum/attachget.asp?id=7706



another thread on this topic:

http://www.proecentral.com/portal/forum/msgDetail.asp?msg_id=2553&for_id=21





-Brian Adkins

 

[Xrez]

Its not that we don't love Pro-E (I do), but as admins and management we also have watch where we are investing our time and money in developing our product. I worked for years for a company using Cadds5. Urrrr, the time came when we were concerned with how long it would be around. The rest is history. That is why I would ask how long it will be around.

I find it funny you would worry about Cadds5 ever going away. It cannot. PTC doesn't own it. They bought the rights to it almost 25 years ago now. Pro-E was going out of business, their software sucked, had so many bugs that it was unfixable. They bought Cadds5 from Prime (Computervision, i.e. CV = Computervision, X5= version), gutted it to fix/rebuild Pro-E, used the new tech to create Creo and told all their customers that were running Cadds5 that they had to switch over to Pro-E. They were going to kill off the application and everyone would have to pay the increased costs for Pro-E. They even went so far as to begin the process. At which point the U.S. Navy came knocking on their door and said, "Thank you, we'll take that now. All the new code, all the original code, all of it." PTC didn't read the fine print when they purchased Cadds5 (formerly Cadds4, CV4X, CV3X, CV2X....the "Cadds" part of the name was from when Prime bought out Computervision and then changed their name back to Computervision. It's very confusing unless you were there). Originally the company designed and built CV1X with support from the U.S. Navy (which I notice is now mysteriously missing from any of the links to the history of CADD you can find on the web) with the help of Professor Hanratty (the Father of CAD). The U.S. Navy did this with a contract that gave them 60% ownership of the software, They gained no profit from the sales, but were allowed unhindered use of the software and ownership rights in perpetuity (forever). With a single line in the contract stating should the software every be sold they will always retain their rights and if any such sales would lead to the termination of said software, all code, engineering, design, and rights to continue the software or kill it would become theirs in sole proprietorship. THAT is the ONLY reason PTC still sells Cadds5 AND is the only reason is has never been upgraded or continued since 2002. They cannot sell it, because they would lose everything. Cadds5 has so much code buried underneath the GUI that most users will never know about, commands that only function if you type them in. It was originally for shipbuilding, is one of the best CAD systems/design tools ever created. There's a reason Boeing used it for wiring, Ford used it for engine and plenum design, Yazaki used it for harness design, Britax used it for body in white surfacing design, and so on.... I am an ex Sr. Wire Harness Designer (Yazaki-NA), Parametric Modeling and Design Engineer (Ford Motor Co., GM, Chrysler, Boeing, Robert Bosch Corp., Hella Lighting, exterior car mirrors with Britax Rainsfords PTY Ltd Adelaide SA, Facility Design with Lockheed Martin Corp, and now a Sr. Engineering Technician/ CAD Tech / BSME with the DoE). Unigraphics Solutions was badarse, UG NX rocks, Catia used to be cool, Solidworks is ok, SDRC Ideas was sweet, really never liked PDGS or CGS, AutoCAD will always get the job done, MicroStation is a strange little niche and decent software, Pro-E will always blow IMHO, but in the end, Cadds5 is God and RULES!!!